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My thinking is can the casino play with a β€œshort deck” similar to BJ. Can they take out some high or low cards and change the odds of the game. It.


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Played well over 29, shoes of baccarat since I started playing at B&M USA casinos. "Don't say it's a winning hand until you are getting paid for.


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1) It's common knowledge at this point that casinos use the shuffle master to cheat people out of their money. 2) They used to use the shuffle.


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I have heard plenty of times how cards can be manipulated inside the shuffle machine and to a point, it may be true. Allow me to opine: The shuffle is the shuffle. To R19 and Big Mac, You said "How in your right mind some of you think baccarat players couldn't identify this straight away is very interesting" Because most baccarat players are naive. And the whole time surveillance, other dealers floor management, and executive management wouldn't notice? I think Wewin is speaking about systems like this which I have never heard of a real house using: Youtube: Baccarat Poker Cheating Shoe Willy Allison just makes some vague statement about it being used in real house play with zero reference. I would prefer to play at houses that show the full process on the casino floor, and do. None of the advantaged play techniques he and his partner did are allowed ever. Trainer likes this. Post it up, but at face value, I would not play with systems like those. Regarding the shuffle machine. Last edited: May 20, And Xander, just quit posting about baccarat because you claim that you have some inside super secret advantaged way to play baccarat when it is clear that you do not play at all. Mcvince , May 22, Joined: Dec 6, Likes: 13 Location: California. Discussions in this section are assumed to be EV- as they are outside of the Advantage Play section. R19 , May 20, Over at the smart guys forum there is a return discussion on a house rigging up baccarat. Baccarat is so deep, it certainly feels like things are full on against if they are going that way. They don't have a clue of what they are doing and don't keep a scorecard, and that's why most lose. Aren't we all in this together? This Technology cannot be beat and it takes cheating to a whole new level. How in your right mind some of you think baccarat players couldn't identify this straight away is very interesting. Ask Questions Non-AP. It is falsely accusing major gaming organizations of cheating and spitting on what they do. If you all what to hand walk a baccarat shoe from manufacturer, through an entire shuffle and cut process to the shoe, good luck. If one does a search for 'baccarat shoe' on the internet, one can see many shoe systems that look like there is a lot of housing between the where the whole shoe is stored and the card exit. Mcvince , May 21, R19 , May 22, The last time I played at the Venetian in February, they opened the box burned one card and started dealing. Each casino does is different in AC. In other words the electronic shoe is capable of dealing the card underneath to allow the casino to have an unbeatable advantage. I haven't been here for a while because I don't like arguing with people, however I think the general public or gambler if you will needs to know this information. They are asses that follow the masses. That is not together. With the exception of the cut card. It may. When a high first card for Player was identified, the players would load up on Player due to the theoretical first card advantage. If the most money is bet on the Player side they will receive the 9 allowing that side to win. If anyone knows of a house where the full process from cards out of the box to first live baccarat hand is not being shown to players, please let us know. That is another reason why your smart guy forum rocks so much. If a house has a rigged setup like this, they would have to be use it selectively, BUT you should be able to notice the setup. That is still their motto. The reason given by the casinos when they introduced shuffle machines was to decrease the time it takes to shuffle cards. If you don't understand the true dynamic of house advantage and how casinos make money, don't start spreading lies about the industry. The touch games have PSC that are thrown onto the table and wash shuffled for two minutes, then hand shuffled. If you want to comment about that case, post in one of those threads, not here. Any quality baccarat offering will not involve anything like this as what Wewin might as well be video baccarat where the house can monitor all bets placed and then based on that switch one or more cards within the baccarat shoe system to affect the outcome. Part of the reason is, at the high limit tables, players are allowed and sometimes encouraged, to handle and mutilate cards on a losing hand. Now are any of these used in actual play at a house? Post it here and our gambling experts will answer it! Just because we pull an natural 8 or 9 doesn't lock a win, and everyone can not count how many key hands that were that close, right? But I have not run across it. For the most part, the "No-touch" NT games are the lower minimums while the higher minimums are for the touch games. It should be right there in front of you. What the electronic shoe and the shuffle master combined the casino is able to decide the outcome of every single hand. Wouldn't it be reversed? In fact, I would bet size that the quality of their shuffle is better than some of the hand dealt baccarat shoes I have played. Youtube: Baccarat Poker Cheating Shoe Willy Allison just makes some vague statement about it being used in real house play with zero reference. This is not footage from real casinos as far as I recall. What is to say any 8 decks are not stacked or rigged. Wouldn't they want the shuffle master in the higher unit games? Last edited: May 22, Big Mac, you specifically stayed that houses are cheating when they are using what is referred to as certified pre- shuffled baccarat shoes. I spent several minutes last night talking about what I saw with a dealer at an empty table and how I would play it and what I was expecting. If there was even a scintilla of an advantage that the casinos can use legally wouldn't all use it? With the exception of the LA CA casinos and the Venetian who manufacture their shoes Cheat , I don't know if it is true about the shuffle master. That is not same team. Furthermore, many houses are using the old school crystal clear baccarat shoe. When you take into account the cut and burn card, it is anyone's guess. That's the game. Maintenance and a dealer s were working with players in a team. Although, Willy Allison is noting this incident, he specifically notes that it was maintenance staff for the house that was colluding with players to get an advantage by learning the first card for Player before bets were placed. Here is a post from DJTeddyBear at another popular forum: March 5th, at AM It is common for casinos to use certified pre-shuffled shoes at the Baccarat tables. The less time the casino wastes on shuffling, the more they keep you playing a negative expectation game, the more money they make.{/INSERTKEYS}{/PARAGRAPH} The problem comes when a certified pre-shuffled shoe is actually not randomly shuffled. Nobody is going to play a rigged game. Fresh cards always, and close monitoring of everything. In reality, it's about their profits and nothing else. It set up perfectly just I called it to happen, but got edged out by the other side. Here are a few things to think about: The games that I have played it seems that the shuffle master is used in the "No-touch" games while a fresh deck of pre-shuffled cards PSC are used in the touch games. That is exactly what they do. Apparently what Wewin has presented so far is not too clear to some, but he is claiming that a house s are using the Shuffle Master to shuffle, then most likely a cut and burn card procedure THEN placement into a a larger baccarat shoe system that has card reading capability AND the system in place to switch cards. Have a gambling question? Did you personally escort them from the manufacturer to the table? Sir Anyone Anyone , May 20, Yes, Dr Sir Anyone Anyone. That being the case, it's easier to purchase cheap cards that are pre-shuffled. I wouldn't really want to be THAT GUY, but if there is a house or house that has a baccarat shoe system that is clearly capable of rigging as Wewin is claiming, then they might as well be named. I get it now. They accomplish this by using the shuffle master to position the cards and using the electronic shoe push the cards out to the side that is favorable for the casino to make the most amount of money on that particular hand. {PARAGRAPH}{INSERTKEYS}Discussion in ' Baccarat Forum ' started by R19 , May 20, Log in or Sign up. Think about it. Welcome to the 1 Gambling Community with the best minds across the entire gambling spectrum. My houses have full card reading built into the baccarat shoe and they area all connected throughout the house, BUT there is no system inside the baccarat shoe that is capable of switching the order of cards. Roubacc , May 22, What would be the motive for me giving you false information? Players play with LVS because Any baccarat player that has even a little seat time should be able to arrive at that view.